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Hi all,

I wanted to confirm a couple things in light of the new naval rules.

1. Assuming I want to increase a fleet's quality, it is no longer possible to sell off all fleets in a sea since you must have one at your initial quality. So now it only makes sense to sell off all but one fleet. Correct?

2. Is the maximum of 16 for the entire fleet or per fleet added. In other words, suppose I have 1 fleet at quality 13 and desire to have an overall quality of 16. Can I purchase a second fleet at quality 19 (by spending 14,000 gold) so that my overall quality is 16?

3. If the answer to #2 is that I cannot spend such that an individual fleet is over 16, then doesn't that mean that mathematically it is impossible to ever actually achieve a fleet quality of 16?

Thanks so much!!!
~Jason
(11-17-2013, 12:38 PM)j2klbs Wrote: [ -> ]Hi all,

I wanted to confirm a couple things in light of the new naval rules.

1. Assuming I want to increase a fleet's quality, it is no longer possible to sell off all fleets in a sea since you must have one at your initial quality. So now it only makes sense to sell off all but one fleet. Correct?

2. Is the maximum of 16 for the entire fleet or per fleet added. In other words, suppose I have 1 fleet at quality 13 and desire to have an overall quality of 16. Can I purchase a second fleet at quality 19 (by spending 14,000 gold) so that my overall quality is 16?

3. If the answer to #2 is that I cannot spend such that an individual fleet is over 16, then doesn't that mean that mathematically it is impossible to ever actually achieve a fleet quality of 16?

Thanks so much!!!
~Jason

1. You can sell them all off, then the first one(s) you build is at your initial fleet quality.
2. Per fleet. No fleet built will ever be above quality 16.
3. True, unless you had an initial quality of 16 in a sea. As a practical matter, you could get to 15.8 or so, but it would be expensive.
(11-17-2013, 03:32 PM)Ry Vor Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-17-2013, 12:38 PM)j2klbs Wrote: [ -> ]Hi all,

I wanted to confirm a couple things in light of the new naval rules.

1. Assuming I want to increase a fleet's quality, it is no longer possible to sell off all fleets in a sea since you must have one at your initial quality. So now it only makes sense to sell off all but one fleet. Correct?

2. Is the maximum of 16 for the entire fleet or per fleet added. In other words, suppose I have 1 fleet at quality 13 and desire to have an overall quality of 16. Can I purchase a second fleet at quality 19 (by spending 14,000 gold) so that my overall quality is 16?

3. If the answer to #2 is that I cannot spend such that an individual fleet is over 16, then doesn't that mean that mathematically it is impossible to ever actually achieve a fleet quality of 16?

Thanks so much!!!
~Jason

1. You can sell them all off, then the first one(s) you build is at your initial fleet quality.
2. Per fleet. No fleet built will ever be above quality 16.
3. True, unless you had an initial quality of 16 in a sea. As a practical matter, you could get to 15.8 or so, but it would be expensive.

Still trying to wrap my mind around why/how these changes improve the game. Anyone able to explain this to me?
(11-17-2013, 05:44 PM)Lord Thanatos Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-17-2013, 03:32 PM)Ry Vor Wrote: [ -> ]
(11-17-2013, 12:38 PM)j2klbs Wrote: [ -> ]Hi all,

I wanted to confirm a couple things in light of the new naval rules.

1. Assuming I want to increase a fleet's quality, it is no longer possible to sell off all fleets in a sea since you must have one at your initial quality. So now it only makes sense to sell off all but one fleet. Correct?

2. Is the maximum of 16 for the entire fleet or per fleet added. In other words, suppose I have 1 fleet at quality 13 and desire to have an overall quality of 16. Can I purchase a second fleet at quality 19 (by spending 14,000 gold) so that my overall quality is 16?

3. If the answer to #2 is that I cannot spend such that an individual fleet is over 16, then doesn't that mean that mathematically it is impossible to ever actually achieve a fleet quality of 16?

Thanks so much!!!
~Jason

1. You can sell them all off, then the first one(s) you build is at your initial fleet quality.
2. Per fleet. No fleet built will ever be above quality 16.
3. True, unless you had an initial quality of 16 in a sea. As a practical matter, you could get to 15.8 or so, but it would be expensive.

Still trying to wrap my mind around why/how these changes improve the game. Anyone able to explain this to me?

Yes. Sea power was a weak element of Alamaze design. I still remember wanting to finally finish (after more than 2 years of work) Alamaze, and had put sea power off and did a half-assed job, by my standards. As history notes, even though we had 2nd Cycle Steel and Magic before Phil took over, I never re-examined sea power until the recent efforts.

I am always going to fix every aspect I think is a design weakness. This can be starting positions for any kingdom, any kingdom special order, or an overall strategic element like sea power.

The old sea power economics were poorly conceived, and essentially left a trick for who wanted to exploit them. There is still suspicious results in sea battles, to be addressed in 3rd Cycle, meaning the sea battles are way too decisive because the algorithms executed are not what was intended.

The game, to answer the question at the surface (forgive the pun) level is better for sea power because it should no longer result in devastating consequences to a sea patrol order. Same effort as exhibited elsewhere with Chaos, Invisible Army Group, Masking, Wall of Flame, etc - all aspects that were exploited because the design was flawed. All those will continue to be eliminated so players can enjoy their campaign, get their whippings from time to time and when deserved, but not side-swipped by some unforeseeable and unaccountable action against them.

I will tell you the next hot spot for me is continuing to hammer on bad High Priestess results, including not divining already divined artifacts.
Thanks for the answers!

I like the changes. I always thought it lame that someone could just sell fleets down to 0 and then rebuild easily to 16. At least this way initial quality matters.

~Jason